Saturday, February 5, 2011

An alternate opinion

A comment was posted on my Psychological Warfare post that was so interesting, I wanted to bring it forward so it wouldn't be buried.

I applaud the teacher--education regarding the care of our environment is a very important topic. We as a society need to be more environmentally responsible. We need to decrease our use of non-renewable resources and reuse what we have, not always buy new. I think there is way too much drama stated here that the 6 year was having "psychological warfare" used on him. This matter can be discussed at home as it well should be. What one chooses to use in their own home is their business, but as adults we need to lead the way in providing a healthy earth for future generations. That six year old is going to grow up and we want him and all six year olds to have a healthy planet in which to live. By- the- way, one must be careful in reusing plastic bags due to certain bacterias. I myself reuse them, but am very careful what I reuse them for. Some bacteria cannot be removed by a simple rinsing even with soap and water. If everyone would decrease their use of something that does not decompose or is non-renewable we could make a significant difference. The choice is of course where you intend to make your difference.


  1. The Anonymous poster stated, " adults we need to lead the way...." Exactly - as ADULTS, not through children who cannot proffer opposition to the teacher's viewpoint.

    God made the earth for us to use, not abuse. But the people on this blog are not abusers, of that I'm sure. And it is not the role of public school teachers to push their personal views onto their captive audiences (students). They should teach, not politicize.

    The message never gets to those who need to hear it - the "usual suspects" - people who are almost always at the head of the class when it comes to filth, abuse, waste, crime, neglect, and the gimme mentality. They care not about the legacy they leave behind. Preach sustainability to those who need to hear it, the rest of us have been doing our part all along. That's what CONSERVatives are all about.

    Anonymous Patriot

  2. I think I will go purchase a case of the baggies. Maybe a case of each size as it looks like it won't be to much longer that they will be available.

    That 6 year old is just that, SIX years old. He shouldn't be made to feel like he is destroying the whole earth by bringing a sandwich in a baggie. Eating disorder, anyone?

    My goodness way to put the weight of the world on a little bitty KID. No wonder these kids are so screwed up. It's obviously not always the parent's fault and proof is here that it is indeed SOCIETY.

  3. The problem as I see it is and always will be is the teacher/adult/parent right? If you teach (not embarass or bully) your child to do something right then it is a good thing. The teacher in this example stepped over the line and decided to embarass and bully her students into doing what she wanted or what is politically correct without regard to what is right. The question in the past was "paper or plastic?". First one was the right answer and then the other. Now neither is right we need to buy shopping bags made from natural fibers and carry half a dozen with us every time we go to the market. I am sure after the dust settles someone will do a study and it will come out that using cotton shopping bags is worse for the environment that paper bags. It is because we don't yet know which of these choices is "right" that we should not be demanding everyone else fall in line behind us.

  4. The commenter missed the point of the original post (OP), which is that it is the role of the parents or guardians to make that decision if the child should be taught that particular lesson, and not the school or teacher. The OP is clearly using the ziploc story as an example of a much broader problem - that the school system has taken upon itself to teach value ideas that are not within its charge.

    This complaint is not a new one. It has been going on for a while.

    We, as society, do depend on schools to teach a certain set of values and to uphold those values, such as no fighting, no profanity, treat each other with respect, good sportsmanship, etc., but those values generally tend to be of the basic level. It becomes a problem when schools and teachers start advocating values above and beyond this basic level, as it may not align with the parent's values that they want to pass onto their children.

    Regardless if the idea is a good one or not, it is not the place for a school or teacher to advocate values above those of basic human behavior.


  5. Playing on a 6 year old's natural desire for a toy is NOT psychological warfare?? Pshawww!

    Steve Davis
    Anchorage, Alaska

  6. Not to mention, what if the parents didn't want anymore polyester, made in China pieces of cheap garbage taking up space in their home? After the child "wins" this piece of trash, it is then up to the parents to live with it or take it away? Besides teaching these children to read, write and do some math, how about just being the kind of example of the values you espouse? The teacher could eat her lunch with the children and show them her reusable sandwich containers.
    BTW, writer, I wash my plastic bags and I CHOOSE to throw away those which held raw meat.

  7. I have nothing to say about the "yea teacher" person. The post speaks for itself. He/she probably doesn't even have a kid.

  8. It is one thing for a teacher to educate students about recycling, it's another to make "being green' an idol, and so ingrain it into a 6-YEAR-OLD that it causes him to cry and rebel against his parents. Enough of the endless guilt trip from the 'save the earth' folks over every convenience item out there (especially when many of them support the killing of babies in the womb - what is more important???). Enough of having them impose their beliefs onto everyone else. If I want to destroy the planet with plastic baggies, what right does anyone have to tell me that I'm wrong, and that I shouldn't.

    It's amazing that many of the same folks promoting this extreme green viewpoint are also the same one's that are very quick to point a finger at Christian's for being 'judgmental,' and 'imposing Christian values' onto them...when they do the exact same thing, telling everyone what products they should and shouldn't use.

    Why doesn't teacher focus more on teaching these kids reading, writing and 'rithmetic, and less on imposing their own worldview.

  9. i wonder what happens to the child in that class room that has the audacity to speak up? probably gets suspended from school for pointing his or her finger. and in many schools these days lord help the child whose parents speak up in the childs behalf. i have "professional teachers" in my family and i have first hand knowledge that they are all left leaning liberal crackpots and with their examples of education - i would rather be disowned and shunned for supporting homeschooling.

  10. Patrice, the type of person who dropped this comment concerns me a bit. I almost get the feeling that it is OK with them for the teacher to usurp parental authority as long as it dovetails with the environmentalist talking points. In other words, “we don’t care what you parents have to say about it (any subject), they are wrong and we are right. Sort of reminds me of that YouTube video that made the rounds last fall with the kids getting blown up because they didn’t agree with the teacher on global warming.

    When I read things like your original post and this type of comment, sure makes me wish that we had bit the bullet and homeschooled our kids. We do talk to them a lot about politics and the state of the world and both boys do seem to have a conservative tilt to their beliefs. In fact, the older boy gets into discussions with some of his friends at school and he has found his friends don’t like to talk politics with him because he generally comes armed with the facts.

  11. I can see it now; the behemoth machine sits idling quietly on the edge of the county landfill, now called the "Mineral Resource Recovery Zone". Soon the operator will release the brake and start another pass through what he has come to call "gray gold" automatically scooping up and separating metal from paper from glass from plastic; the recovery vehicles following close behind slowly filling with material from their assigned conveyor belt.

    If we're lucky, says the operator, we'll hit a vein of pure Ziplock bags; China pays a pretty penny for that stuff ya know...shoot, I remember, in school the teacher said we couldn't even use the things. He shuts the cabin door and grinds off down what used to be a mountain and is now becoming a valley again...

  12. Re the writer of the alternate opinion at the top: to say we wash and reuse bags is not to say we reuse all of them, duh! Does she think that only she is careful in what she reuses?? I am offended that the commentor assumes the rest of us are too stupid not to know that we should throw away bags that held meat. :) Par for the course with the environmentalists ...they know it all!
    Concerning lunch time: I reuse heavy-duty bags, I use plastic containers, I use waxed paper, I use small corning dishes bought 30 years ago for reheating food at work-- just what should I be using to hold lunch that would satisfy these enviro-nuts? Or maybe I should get in my car and drive to lunch everyday?? sorry, I'm getting carried away! :)

  13. And they say there is no religion in the public schools... Jennifer

  14. OH no! My comment about which bags I reuse was about an adult making a choice, not implying that you were too stupid to choose which bags to reuse. I was a homeschooler, cloth diaperer,and bag washer probably longer than the teacher terrorizing the 6 year old has been alive. My point was about adults (parents) making choices about raising their children and the teachers should stick to the basics and leave their own political views out of it. I believe in being good stewards of our resources but draw the line when environmentalism is used to brainwash children into spying on their parents or as a justification for abortion.

  15. Bottom line is this is what you get when the village idiots are allowed to teach, influence and abuse our children. Heaven knows how many of these socialists are teaching our kids under the mantra 'It takes a village to raise a kid' nanny state results. Whoever abused that kid by applying mental torture needs to be arrested.
    Had Enuff

  16. I find it to be the same, sad ol' statement of society when an individual or group of individuals dictates what is best and right for all of the rest of us while screaming, "CHOICE" regarding abortion or "Tolerance" regarding any view that butts heads with their own views.

    What is equally nothing new, is the fact that people like the one with the 'alternate' response, as well as the proponents of the teaching methods discussed, are fixated on a symptom rather than facing truthfully the disease. No leader and no group can FORCE man to take care of this earth if man has no understanding or appreciation for its origins. It is no different from demanding that the tenth heir to a vast fortune be responsible with that fortune, when the heir has no appreciation of the work that his ancestors put into amassing that fortune. To the heir, it's just a free lunch to be rightfully used at his discretion.

    When man determines to remove God from the public square, to deny God's miraculous creation and to place responsibility of existence on man himself, there is no understanding of God's power over the weather, or the terra firma or man's own circumstances. It all just becomes "good works" that grow very tiresome and fruitless because they are done in man's strength and not in God's strength. As Adrian Rogers quipped: "Whatever man does without God, he will fail miserably or succeed even more miserably." But even stronger, "God does not appreciate what He does not initiate."

  17. The truth that is lacking here is: only GOD can destroy the earth! He made it to heal itself, enviros tend to think that we are totally responsible for this planet. Yes we need to be good stewards, and we need to think of future generations, but there needs to be some balance.
    People tend to think that my family are green fanatics, as we recycle and we use more reusable items than disposable items. It is just economically better for us to use the reusable items.
    And I am very glad that I homeschool because I do not want the world to indoctrinate my boys. There are so many worldviews that are against what we believe the world can keep them!

  18. Regarding Jim's comment above - Mineral Resource Recovery Zone - We take our trash to what used to be called the "dump"; then it was called the "landfill"; and now it's called the "convenience center". Guess MRRZ will be next.

  19. When I see the primary core academics of math, science and literature scores improving (not ecology or greenology taught as earth science) as benchmarks in our tax paid school systems, then I'll consider actually benefiting from my mandatory governmental garnishments which comprise about 13% of my taxes paid overall, and start using the public school systems. Until then, homeschooling is the only way to ensure that my children are not being subjected to instructors social projects and behaviorally conditioning based on their biased value systems and the ludicrous goal outcomes set by these Liberalist based priorities as accomplishment indicators for students.

    How is it that this commenter hypocritically states she is an offender of the environment herself, (thus is setting a poor mentoring example for her own children) by using a baggie product that is deemed foresaken by the first condemning commentor?

    What a Classic example of convoluted logic.


  20. I agree with Steve up in Alaska: this is about a little boy who fears not getting a prize. It's been proven in studies that bribery works only in the smallest of children, then it becomes a fear of loss instead of an incentive.

    The mom could have handled this very simply. If he didn't want a ziplock baggie, pull out the wax paper and have him cut, wrap, and tape his sandwich up. Then she needs to pull out the mom power and mention how much more time that took but the waste about seems to be about the same. Real life examples from parents are more powerful than teachers.

    The craziest part of this story is that toy. It's probably a cheap PLASTIC toy that will soon be forgotten about and tossed into the garbage.

  21. I was one of those worried children - genuinely concerned about saving the world and sick to my stomach about every bit of waste I saw around me. The irony is that I didn't come from a wasteful or materialistic family at all. (the few things I had were hand-me-downs). Still I bore the weight of the world on my shoulders.

    As I grew up, travelled and learnt about the world around me, I changed my view. For instance, so many cities don't recycle at all. Not even beverage bottles. Why was I torturing myself over minimal amounts of waste?
    Why was I torturing myself at all? My parents taught me moderation and responsibility in life in general. After that, life should be happy.

    Now in hindsight, I resent the environmental indoctrination that made me feel guilty, panicked, unhappy, instead of just reflecting and endorsing a healthy, happy balanced life.

    And now I resent what's happening to this poor kid with the ziploc bag. He's learning NOTHING about livng a healthy, happy balanced life.


  22. I started having dreams about a nuclear bomb going off right over head at around age 50. I live in a strategic hotspot and I see this as no coincidence but rather a heads up. The return of Jesus Christ may well happen in your lifetime.