Country Living Series

Monday, September 16, 2013

Prepping with unruly kids

Lee over at The Dependent Independent posed an interesting question, to wit: How do you deal with unruly kids when the bleep hits the fan?


His post presenting this issue is here. He has an additional post here. Chime in on his blog and offer your two cents.

22 comments:

  1. "Behind the wood shed" comes to mind.

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  2. I am the father of 5, grandfather of 7, and great-grandfather of 2.
    There is no simple answer to your question. What to do depends on how old the kids are, the nature of their misbehavior, whose kids they are (yours or relatives), what your corrective action options are at the time, and the potential consequences of their misbehavior.

    Hangtown Frank

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    1. Very well said. I would also add this, how it is handled would depend upon the mental maturity of the child as well. Not meaning that an immature teen would get away with stealing and/or using drugs. I mean something more along the lines of a mentally challenged 12 year old getting a stern talking to instead of "being taken behind the woodshed" for a minor infraction. It is a sad fact that some people judge to quickly a "misbehaving" child when those people do not have any information other than what they see.
      Clem

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  3. Ineffective parents and their unruly children would not be welcomed where we intend to be if The Schumer Hits The Fan.

    Just an observation, there must be at least 30 children at our church. Honestly, NOT ONE is unruly. Our worship services last slightly over 2 hours. Those children age 4 and older sit quietly (youngest may do coloring or otherwise quietly occupy themselves) through services. What else do all of our children have in common? Every one is homeschooled.
    Montana Guy

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    1. Instead of welcoming someone who might/obviously need(s) help with parenting, or with other issues so they CAN parent, you would just shut the door on them? Your whole church feels this way? You know, not everyone has it all together in all the same areas.
      Clem

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    2. There are SO many people nowadays who need help with parenting, but especially in dire crisis, don't expect others to solve your problems for you. Churches are full of people needing help and asking for it while not even attempting to repent, submit, and learn from godly parents and mentors. And the attitudes of those spoiled, unruly kids ends up rubbing off on the good kids. Even for God, the way is narrow; not everyone gets into Heaven, because the social "justice" of humans is not based on the same calculus as the Holy and Just God's.

      While we should engage the world and offer hope to those who have little or none, we as Christians should remember the admonition to come out of the world and to separate ourselves and our impressionable children from the divisive and the evil around us.

      Yes, Montana Guy, I agree with you.

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    3. Sorry parents of 5 or 6 year old who haven't learned to sit quite as still as the 4 year olds in MY church. Your not welcome! God has a narrow way, and you just don't cut it. Not everyone gets into Heaven you know.
      Sorry kids, your parents asked for help and since they didn't do anything to EARN our help we're just gonna go ahead and write them off. Oh, I guess that means you will probably grow up in a home where your parents bad mouth all churches. Eh, so what if you never learn to love church. Your parents were losers. It's not like being around a bunch of well behaved church loving kids would rub off on YOU anyway.
      It's not anyone's fault that they are not welcome but their own. Our church family has a rhythm. THOSE people just shouldn't come. They throw off our groove.

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  4. I would like to respond to his post but I can't. He doesn't offer a profile for "Anon". I can only use that one because I don't understand the others/or/have the information for the others.

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  5. I also found it too challenging to post a comment directly on his site. But wanted to share..

    I don't have any brilliant solutions.. But I started working in the mental health field this year, and it has been personally shocking to learn how many children and adolescents have violent mental health problems. The immensity of the problem after SHTF is just barely sinking in to me, but families really need to think about their own children's behaviors, and what to do when faced with unstable folks, youth and adults. Some of these kids are 3. Only 3, but have so many violent issues to be in a program... Now imagine the same kid at 16. Then 19, when they've aged out of state funded mental health programs. Now imagine them without the police to call.

    Most folks imagine one or two kids in a community, or a private home somewhere for troubled kids. In my town of 80,000, there are Hundreds of kids with such issues. Hundreds. Not counting the ones that aren't in services, or the ones that are now adults. If this is your child, or your family, work with them NOW to get on the right path. Don't let someone else "handle them" after SHTF.

    Most folks reading these blogs already demonstrate a certain level of intelligence and foresight so as to not have unruly children. I don't mean to say we don't have free spirited or rebellious children. I mean as a general rule, we have less children with violent mental health issues than the general public. After asking life-long professionals in the mental health field day after day, how does this happen? The best answer I've been given is that generation after two generations now, these kids come from drug-filled parents. It does something to their biochemestry, removing empathy and standard coping mechanisms we develop naturally (like breathing, calming yourself and learning to control the bursting rage in your chest). The kids.. that's missing. They're the second or third generation of this.. imagine if your parents had no empathy. At all. Ever. Imagine if they ignored you or didn't feed you, or changed your diaper once every 48 hours as a newborn. It's no excuse for the kids, or for their parents. It's just to understand. It's not necessarily "fixable" either. It's just something that preppers need to be aware of. There are many, many many more people like this out there, in your own community, than you think. And you should be afraid of them.

    The only thing -THE ONLY THING- that keeps some of the more violent adolescents in check is the threat of police action and juvie. If that were gone.. well, where do you think the gangs come from in every SHTF story? Where do you think the empathy-lacking killers come from?

    Sorry.. I know that's long; it's just something I'm becoming more and more concerned about personally, and thus more passionate about in sharing. If you have a child in your family, however extended, exhibiting signs of violence (beyond "teen rebellion"), try to get them help now, in whatever form.

    I'm frightened to think what I'll have to do to protect my family after TSHTF from these kids, and these grown ups. Have you thought about that? Can you take action against a violent 8 year old who would kill you without blinking? Could you? They're only 8..

    It wasn't until I shadowed our mental health programs did the concept of such a violent 8 year old really hit home. I couldn't imagine it.. how could such a little kid be so dangerous? But they are.. chillingly so. Some are being redeemed through such mental health programs. And some are beyond being helped. But if you can't picture a violent 8 year old... just know they exist, and ask yourself what you'd do if they tried to hurt your family.

    And what would you do if that kid was your own?

    ~ Sandy

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    1. Ma'm if you would be willing to perhaps start a blog on your thoughts I would be very interested in reading. Just saying

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    2. We currently have a society, of spoiled, unruly, rude, people who have lost their moral compass, if they ever had one to begin with. Mental health programs don't work.

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    3. Thank you PalmCityGirl. I'm not sure I would know what more to say. I wish I knew more, I wish I was better educated about mental health. I wish I could share thoughts from the perspective of a mental health professional. And yet, at the very same time, I'm glad that I can not, for left in my layman's state, I am not blinded by the clinical terms and theories of mental health. I just know, as a prepper, that the number of violent mentally ill folks in my town and in yours is a very underlooked concern.

      Be safe,

      ~ Sandy

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  6. Not on this topic, but just seen on facebook, that Tattler Reusable Canning lids is featuring your fruit vinegar post on their page. Looks like people like it!

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    1. Sweet! Thanks for letting me know.

      - Patrice

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  7. "unruly children" don't eat all their food or don't want to go to bed on time. What you are describing is a psychosis and you need to recognize it for what it is. This kid needs professional help (and clearly so does your sister-in-law). Kids like this usually grow up to be even worse and your property, your life and even your legal liability is at risk if you take them in. Do I sound to strident to you? Well, the choice is yours to make. You can choose to avoid this child as much as possible especially do not let them in your home or near your children OR you can try to help him and eventually understand what I am talking about. I am not saying this child (or other children who act like this) can't ever break out of this destiny, but I am saying the odds are against it and these kind of people usually end up hurting anyone who is close to them.

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  8. Well, no offense to Lee, but I can tell you what I would NOT do. That is air my family dirty laundry on a public blog.
    He may think his family does not or will not read his blog, or that people who know his SIL and his nephew will never figure out who he is talking about, but I have had several friends who thought so - to their great embarassment.
    Perhaps he does not care about redeeming the relationship, but what about his mother and father in law? I just feel that a teen who is acting out like this needs more people he can trust/count on/look up to, not fewer. If the only stable people in his life have "written him off" and held him up to shame in public, where is he going to go if & when God DOES start turning him around?
    I think "be a person who can be trusted" is good advice for life now, as well as if SHTF.

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  9. I could not post on the blog because I did not wish to sign up for one more thing.

    If anyone is interested, here is the post:

    "If TSHTF and one or more of your children becomes unruly during and possibly because of this event would you be able to handle this along with what is going on around you?"

    It is interesting that you asked this question. Our six children are now adults, and all but one is one has moved out, and have families of their own. While they were growing up, my husband and I lived what other people considered a "strict" lifestyle. We went to Church regularly, there was no alcohol in the house, the girls (3) were expected to wear dresses/skirts and no pants, the boys (3) were expected to wear a shirt and tie to Church and they learned early to tie one. There was much that we did not do and did not allow. Not because of "rules," we had, but because of the "rules" in the Bible, and our acceptance of Jesus Christ. While my husband and I were, and are, and still are not perfect, we walked our talk instead of just talking our talk. We got a lot of flack and many "questions." "What would you do if your daughter rebelled and wore pants? They didn't. What would you do if they rebelled and listened to Hard Rock music or some other (Satanic) music?. It didn't happen. In the end, despite our faults, our children are saved, love the Lord, attend Church regularly, do not listen to Rock/Hard/Heavy Metal, etc., music, and do not have TV hook up in their homes. They all have professional jobs, and good marriages. The problem with your SIL is not that she does not get along with your MIL. It is because of who they are. They need to get right with the Lord, and by what you said, it won't be long before they all act like the oldest. I would have minimum to no contact with this family. What is more important? Bad family ties, or your child's development? If you did what we did, your children will not become unruly. Notice I didn't say anything about bad times. **ANY** time you allow your children to be influenced by others. It takes fortitude for a parent to live right. This teaches the child to live right as well. You child rearing book should be the Bible. It is replete with bad parents and what happened to them. Even great godly men like David.

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  10. I think what struck me was is that the blogger is worried about an unruly child in a SHTF scenario. This nephew IS in a SHTF scenario. He's not unruly....he's a drug addict, drug dealer, a thug, and a thief. That's not unruly, its criminal behavior. And, as far as I'm concerned, the mother-in-law is at risk of harm. Deal with the current crisis and not some dramatic notion.

    The average kid is either has discipline and will persevere in a SHTF scenario .... or a troublesome kid will either find it within themselves to straighten out in a crisis, or they won't. If you have a gangsta 16 yo now, a EMP strike really isn't going to matter to him.

    (the next part is tongue in cheek folks)

    On the other hand, the nephew should be befriended. In the event of a SHTF, he may actually be a valuable asset. What? You Say! The young man is a skilled raider (thief) and has a skill that can be bartered, manufacturing pharmaceuticals (drugs). He's a gangsta thug and would not have a problem defending the compound. He could potentially be a very powerful ally.

    But sleep with one eye open. (just kidding)

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  11. See the website itsnotmyproblem.org

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  12. It's not just the issue of unruly children that struck me recently, but how to ensure that non-problem children are aware of what they should and shouldn't say in a survival situation. The UK TV channel, Channel 4, recently aired a fictional documentary about a week in which the whole of the UK's electricity network went down. No power for petrol pumps, cash machines, hospitals (except for generators and then they gave out and were reduced to dwindling batteries for life support machines)....With a couple of days society went completely feral. A naive urban self-sufficiency guy invited neighbours he didn't know to share their barbecue so they could cook their food. One of his children made a remark that it didn't matter if their mobile phone battery died, as they could charge it on their generator. Next night - family was raided by next door neighbour and his pals, and cleaned out not just of generator but all their stockpile of food. End of the programme (I can tell you without spoiling because you can't access the replay outside the UK) was the urban idealist beating a guy to death in a fight over food in a looted supermarket.
    Made me really think hard about how to tell children what it's safe and unsafe to say.

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