Friday, August 29, 2014

Inconvenient truths about TEOTWAWKI

I found this cheery list on Todd Savage's Strategic Relocation blog. If nothing else, it gives sobering food for thought. (I found #11 especially true... because at this point we're ALL armchair survivalists. #22 is also true -- trust me on this.)

Just to clarify, the list as well as the commentary that follows was reprinted from the blog post; it's not anything I wrote.


28 Inconvenient Truths About TEOTWAWKI

The end of the world as we know it may hold realities that are
very, very different from our expectations. Consider these points:

1. Not everyone will survive. Ouch.
2. For many, circumstances will trump preparedness.
3. Preparedness will cost money. There's no way around it.
4. If you talk about preparedness, you'll be ridiculed. If you
keep your mouth shut, you'll miss out on establishing a support
system that is 100% necessary to survival.
5. A rural retreat won't save you. The federal government has
you in their cross-hairs, as does the United Nations.
6. Stored food runs out, eventually.
7. Even the best prepared survivalist Navy Seal can be brought down
by an infected ingrown toenail.
8. You probably aren't tough enough for what's coming.
9. Gold and silver may be useless if a world currency is
established. Using them may even be criminalized.
10. In a time of plenty, it's impossible to imagine the reality
of true scarcity.
11. Survival is easy for armchair quarterbacks.
12. Most survivalists and preppers are overly optimistic when it
comes to how much food store, what scenarios to plan for, and their
ability to survive off the grid.
13. TEOTWAWKI will change the way you and your children and
grandchildren live. Forever.
14. The minute you bug out, your chances of reaching your retreat
destination are slim.
15. You're kidding yourself if you think your hidden caches
won't be found by others, eventually.
16. You won't know if you're ready for TEOTWAWKI until
you're in the middle of it.
17. Ultimately, a too-powerful government will be the biggest
threat to your survival.
18. Life will become cheap.
19. Free time will become a thing of the past.
20. There's nothing wrong with preparing for natural disasters,
but if you're not ready for a collapse of the American economy,
you're not ready.
21. Coming tough times will threaten even the best of marriages and
other close relationships.
22. Growing your own food is a bigger challenge than you ever
thought possible.
23. Depending on where you live and any drought conditions, a green
garden can be spotted from miles away, thus endangering your food
source and your family.
24. Dealing with human waste and trash will become your new
part-time job.
25. You'll discover exactly what you're capable of when your
family is threatened.
26. Formerly strong and capable people will escape their new reality
through booze, drugs, and/or suicide.
27. Protecting and nurturing close family ties will become one of
the most important things you can do.
28. Those who can accept and adapt will find survival easier than
those who hold on to the past or have unrealistic expectations of
the future.

None of these points are especially cheerful. In fact, they're
downright discouraging. However, the fact that you are preparing
for difficult times, as well as everyday emergencies, is very
Encouraging! You're aware of storm clouds on the horizon and
you know it will hit eventually.

Do something this week to become just a little better prepared!
(Relayed by Ryan L Olsen)

(reprinted with permission)


  1. One Second After (Forstchen) is a good book to read for some reality dosed hard truths about TEOTWAWKI.

    While some romanticize about gardening or water storage with no bureaucratic intervention, the hard truth is that if you survive and hunker down, you will have to deal with the hordes of FSA (free S%^t Army), those off their meds, and those that just go plumb crazy insane. And chivalry will be dead.

    A Failure of Civility is also a good book to read. Now.
    My daughter calls it the apocalypse after the apocalypse.

    See the
    Walking Dead for research.


    1. BINGO fjord! If you read just two books, those are the two I'd also recommend. 'Patriots' by James Wesley Rawles is also excellent.

      Having stuff is great. Having like-minded people with you will be priceless. Finding them (and vetting them) takes time. Start NOW.
      Montana Guy

  2. Re no 22: I always shake my head at the survival seeds in a can commercials. You can do everything correctly gardening and still starve if your life depends on what you grow.

    Gonna turn that front yard into enough food to keep you through the winter? Probably not.

    Here in the Blue Ridge Mountains I have had another dismal tomato/pepper/beet year. Green beans gave us 2 canner loads, then gave up under 10 days of intermittent rain.

    We're not newbies--been gardening this spot to varying degrees for the past 25 years. That's why I always plant 100 tomatoes, because a good year keeps us in maters through the bad years.

    1. You need protein in order for proper brain/muscular activity. Ask the N. Koreans.

      the best source of protein is animal products; beef, eggs, meat.

      that's why the progressives keep pushing the livestock is bad for the environment/your health propaganda.


  3. Thanks for passing this along, Patrice. It's a sobering and realistic analysis.

    My view has long been that many of the survivors would wish they hadn't.

    I think number 2, number 5 and number 8 would quickly tell the tale for many if not most of us, regardless of preparedness. And if not then number 7 soon would.

    I would add a number 29, to the effect that coyotes, bobcats, raccoons, skunks, mountain lions, wolves and bears will prosper and multiply in many places, particularly in places we now consider urban areas. Lost/injured/undefended/dead pets and people would make for abundant meals and easy prey. Man would no longer be at the top of the food chain.

    A. McSp

    1. um, not really. last time all the animals were decimated. several predators were hunted to extinction in the lower 48.

    2. Your post makes no sense.

    3. Riverrider, it sounds like you entirely missed McSp's point. When people are gone from an area, wild animals tend to increase in number in that area. When TSHTF, there won't BE anyone around to decimate the animals. Most will not be prepared and will probably starve. This is the point preppers like Patrice have been making for many years.

    4. Domesticated dogs revert to their pack predator instincts. Wild dogs are killers. Arm yourself and if you see a wild dog in the wild shoot and ask later.

  4. The list contains many common sense truths, albeit from a pessimistic viewpoint.
    I’ve been prepping for over ten years and I found the list downright depressing and rather than encourage someone to start preparing, I would guess it would make them prefer to commit suicide when TEOTWAWKI hits. In fact I would sum up the list in one sentence…TEOTWAWKI is hard and then you die.
    Well duh, that’s been life since creation. True we as a nation have gotten really soft and when society goes sideways, many will probably sit in a corner, rocking with their thumbs in their mouth waiting to die....But not everyone. Not me and not mine. And I would say not many in the community which I’m part of. Most survivors are people who have hope, people who are optimistic. I’ve found it’s the pessimist who are not prepared, who aren’t willing to bother, and will be the ones who will give up and die.
    I understand the ‘hard’ truth’s the creator of this list is trying to portray, I’m no Pollyanna, and I’m more than willing to decapitate some predator’s head and fix it to a post to provide a no trespassing sign to those who would seek to deprive my family and friends of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
    That being said, this is a cute list that pushes fear and may help sell real estate for those marketing to the survivalist/prepper’s market, but I’ve found that hope and optimism are what provides purpose for survival.
    I guess what I’m trying to say is, that when it comes to making converts, you will attract and reach more people with honey and old fashioned common sense, not by fearmongering.
    - A long time prepper with a background in military training, survival training, and ministerial training, who is presently franching (farming and ranching) in a Midwestern state, while living in a continuous state of prepping, but with the understanding that this world is not my home, I’m just a passing through. Because prepping is as much about preparing for the next life as it is for this one.

    1. I started researching prepping a few years ago. I have taken some steps to prepare for an urban SHTF scenario. While doing my research I came to many conclusions that match the list. #1 was first and foremost. There are PDF files published by the government (DHS in particular) that recognize millions of people will die within a few weeks. Anyone on a medical life support, the elderly, children without adults will proably be the first to go. Then gangs will form and fight each other causing more death. I'm sure most people reading this have read the scenarios. My point, I didn't stop reading or researching and spending money for equipment just because of the possible consequences. I altered my thought processes and equipment and food buys. If the above list demoralizes someone then they probably don't have what it takes to survive anyway. Because there won't be any good news in the days and weeks following a major catastrophe like losing the power grid.

  5. Nice list, but he left one out. Hordes of starving desperate people will swarm out of cities. With no survival skills at all they will quickly begin taking from others by force...

  6. +100 to Anonymous above!

    i honestly couldn't agree more. i would also add that fearmongering is big business in the survival/prepping world. what is crazy is that less than 100yrs ago EVERYBODY grew their own food, prepped for the winter, shared meals with their families, got in enough firewood for the winter - this is not rocket-science people! but once you start throwing in modern-day gadgets like seed vaults and bunkers - it all starts to get a little out of control. it's really very easy to go and find a rural community, buy some land, make friends with the locals - but first, you must get rid of ideas of outdoing the Joneses, get rid of credit, pay off all debt and then git yer butt to a small community. while you are doing all of that - start a garden, start growing at least some of your food, learn how to preserve and can, fish, hunt, and save seeds.

    again, not rocket science. but the "armchair" survivalists, the pessimists will tell you the opposite. and i truly agree with Anonymous' point about preparing for the next life, while preparing for this one.

    1. 1914 is 100 years ago. My grandmother was born in 1892. and we she was married in 1915. While she did all of the non-food self sufficiency type things when she lived at home, until her husband got sick, she did not. Those skills kicked in, however, when she found herself a widow with a kid and no money. There was never a garden.

      The other relatives? No self reliant attitude there. Even during the height of the Depression, they didn't bake their own bread but walked several miles for day old bread. No sewing either. And why would they buy chocolate Easter candy just to make chocolate pudding is beyond me.

      The Ingalls of Little House fame purchased food and supplies a lot . They had to. Like everyone else throughout history, things happen. Early frosts, snow in the summer (it did happen), or insect plagues can mean buy something or starve.

      For us, the unprecedented cold winter in the north east resulted in no apples in our orchard this year and cool late summer is delaying maturity at almost all the local farms. I am not sure what we will be able to get out of the garden.Everything is weeks behind maturity. Our main crop to put up for man and beast, butternut squash doesn't look as though it is going to be very abundant. I could not put up any local fruit this year, either. No one had any or limited amounts at a price.

      We all have distorted viewpoints of what happened "in the old days."

    2. thanks Tewshooz!

      Anonymous - i don't where you live or how you were brought up, but i am 43 and when i was a child everyone still had gardens. not only that, i grew up in a fishing village and am back in one now. everyone hunts and fishes. yes, the Ingalls bought supplies, but that's because they grew mostly grains and only a little garden. everyone had coldrooms and springrooms. so again, i state, that when i grew up - all of this stuff was considered normal.

    3. Anonymous,
      I am assuming you live in the USA and understand that there are many different lifestyles that are somewhat based on the different regional areas. I live in the same state I was raised in, but my self reliant lifestyle couldn't be further from the way I was raised. The point I was making is that not "Everyone" was living an agrarian type lifestyle 100 years ago.

      My first paragraph made reference to my grandmother and her family. She was born in 1892. That is more than 100 yrs ago. My second paragraph referred to my maternal side of the family. My mother was raised by her grandmother, who was born approx1860s-70's. Both lived in and around major northeastern cities. Neither were interested in farming, although it was my paternal grandmother who had the largest skill base and needed to use it during the depression. She was a city girl for sure.

      My reference concerning the Ingalls was based on information from other sources than the historical fiction books that we are familiar with. Gardening or farming is a turkey shoot. Through no fault of farmer/gardener, the crops fail. Blame it on the Fall (Adam and Eve).

      Those who live in and around cities do not usually plant gardens. That was the attitude of most people who lived in the post WW2 housing development I grew up in. If they did grow a vegetable garden, it was small. The backyards were small. Putting up food for the winter would have been impossible with how tiny the gardens were. In fact, we were the only family that I was aware of that had a chest freezer in the basement. Mom froze food that was on sale. She made jam once.

      As an aside, FerFAL did quite well as a modern day survivalist in Argentina without the depth of preparations that most people have come to understand as essential.

      How everything is going to play out is anybody's guess. Nothing anyone can say or do will change the plan of those that are behind the scenes. In the end, it will not be pretty. The most essential preparation, however, is getting right with God.

      You set the parameters of the time and behavior

  7. Regarding #22 --- true fact.

    I'm often reminded of the scene from "Gone With The Wind" where a starving Scarlet is out in her decimated garden, hunting frantically for anything the Yankees failed to confiscate.

    She finds one or two lone potatoes and utters the line of the century: "As God is my witness, I'll never be hungry again."

    Some things just stick with you. Since I first saw that movie, I often wonder what I would have done in her situation to survive.

    Just Me

    1. Carrots...I think they were carrots

    2. Oh, tank you, tank you. You're probably right. It must be time for me to watch the movie again. Or read the book again. I love that scene. It was when I first realized how scarce food can become.

      Just Me

    3. Just Me

      On Sun, Sep 28 and one week later. Gone with the Wind will have a 2pm and a 7 pm showing in select movie theaters. Celebrating the 75th Anniversary (I think).


    4. A good prepper bit of wisdom... one is none, two is one and three are two.

  8. But here is what YOU need to know:

    1. It's later then you think.

    2. Food will be worth more then money in the future.

    3. Someone you know intends to either sponge off you or take what you have when things get tough.

    4. Someone you don't know intends to either sponge off you or take what you have when things get tough.

    5. By the time it is obvious to everyone it will be too late to prepare.

    6. If you don't prepare then you are the one planning on sponging off someone you know or to take what they have when things get tough.

  9. Wow. Anon @ 11:18 AM that was spot on. I have almost stopped using the word prepper in many ways. In my case prepping has evolved into sustaining and doing things on my property that I may never reap the benefits of in my own lifetime. It's about the future and as kymber said it ain't rocket science.

    I would add though that in my opinion the real danger is that so many ways of doing things without cheap, abundant energy could be lost. We are right on the edge of losing so much knowledge and if we lose it before the modern system falls apart we could be in even bigger trouble.

    For my part I am done prepping for my lifetime and focusing more on prepping for those who come along after me if I can.

    1. Pioneer Preppy,

      I really like this sentiment - leaving the land better than you found it. That's a wonderful legacy.

      Each year, I make sure and plant two new trees. One to sustain me now such as an apple, or a cherry. And one to sustain those who come after me, like a sugar maple or a black walnut.

      Just Me

    2. Best time to plant a tree...20 years ago.
      Next best time to plant a

  10. +100 to PP! one of the smartest sustainers i know of!

  11. I agree with many of these items, but I believe several are overblown and some are dependent on where you live.
    In particular: 5 & 17 dealing with the government - Yes, a powerful, oppressive government can cause big problems, BUT No, they are not omniscient; only God is. Government, especially an oppressive one, can't be everywhere at once - all human institutions have limits. Read Larry Burkett's The Illuminati and The Thor Conspiracy for a Christian based dystopian view of the future. One aspect that I agree with is that the further you are from big cities, and in particular Washington DC, the less government control there is likely to be. If you are worried about being tracked, look at a map of how much of the US has no cell phone service and few roads - it just isn't worth 'them' expending that much effort.
    When things get bad, as shown recently by events in Ferguson, government and law enforcement focuses first on urban areas. Another example is that at the height of the USSR, rural areas, particularly poor ones, were neglected by the central government and not closely monitored.

  12. Having been in many third world countries most will not be ready for the extreme violence when there is no rule of law. If people thought Katrina was bad that was nothing.

  13. Here is a hopeful thought; “But the blood on your doorposts will serve as a sign, marking the houses where you are staying. When I see the blood, I will pass over you” Exodus 12:13 NLT. The plague of death did not touch the Israelites if they had the blood applied to their door posts when God struck the land of Egypt with the death plague. I am not insinuating that we should apply blood to our door posts. What I am saying is; if we are Christians why not apply the same principle? Ask God to have what is coming pass over us or at least hide us from it.
    Here are 2 examples of what I am talking about. My dad in 60’s went into an inner city of a large metropolitan area to start a Christian school. He moved into the inner city as well. As you can imagine it was very unsafe. During this time a neighbor ask him who the two men were that was guarding his house. They were not men; the neighbor could see the angels that were guarding his home. In the10 plus years that my dad lived in that house, there was not one incident…. my dad was completely safe in an area with untold crime. The other incident that comes to mind is; my dad had someone looking for him. I think it came from a traffic altercation. He felt it was safer in a fast food restaurant, so while he was inside the people came in looking for him. They were looking right at my dad and could not see him. I do have to say, my dad often spent hours in prayer.
    I think preppers are often self made people and/ or depend on themselves. We should be doing as much as we can to prep and completely trusting god with the rest. Or, could it be fear? Here is an antidote for fear; a relationship with Jesus or a better relationship with him. John 1:1-21 Jesus replied, “I assure you, no one can enter the Kingdom of God without being born of water and the Spirit. Also, check out Acts 2:38. Search the scriptures to make sure you are right with God. After that it is all up to God.

    1. Although blood painted across the front of my house and fence will definitely create an Impression... From one Christian to another, thanks for the idea!

  14. 5, 9, and 17 are too true.
    the satellite pictures alone will rat you out.
    the government seems to be the nightmare since it is no longer [maybe never really was] of the people.
    only Go can protect us. but remember the martyrs.
    it is true that we will not all survive, but some of us who survive may wish we hadn't.

    deb h.

  15. I never really understood people hoarding gold for an end of the world scenario. When people are starving a hunk of bread is of more value than a hunk of gold. Yes, gold holds it's value through most economic disasters but it's not a logical part of TEOTWAWKI prep. At least not to me anyway.

  16. I propose, for those of us in the trenches, that it is nearly impossible to know what is going to happen when everything falls apart. There are those who do know, but I am guessing that even "their" plans can go off on tangents. God is all knowing, and He will not be mocked.

    I am glad that Anonymous mentioned the Civil War. It wasn't just the Yankees that caused starvation. The Confederacy had no manufacturing. The government had confiscation laws (actually both sides did) and used them. The men and women were generous with their personal supplies for the troops early in the war. Within a short period of time, the population had no food, shelter, clothing, shoes, fuel, transportation, paper, medicines and more. By the end of the war, butchers had dressed rat in the window...when they could find one. Hmmm. Don't we have currently have confiscations laws and more?

    **No one can prepare physically for all possible scenarios.
    **There is no such thing as like minded people.
    **We are all too soft.
    **We are a deskilled society.
    **The British government controlled **everything** during WW2. Farms (bad grade and they were confiscated (2,000)and one person was killed) The farmers were required to kill their own sheep herds.
    **They controlled all aspects of UK life down to how many buttons and square meters requirements for your clothing.
    **I have been reading lately on how our society breeds narcissists. I have known two quite well. It won't be fun with that thrown into the mix. If you do not know this personality, I suggest you research now.

    Goods will be available. Unfortunately, it won't be for everyone as Revelation tell us that no one could buy or sell without the mark of the beast.

    Make sure you purchase sturdy shoes.

    1. Farmers who wouldn't bfarm during WW2 could have their farms taken over, they still owned them but were worked largely by the women's land army. This was because we were dramatically short of food. Allotments, small plots of land where people grew their own, were encouraged and anything you grew was yours. Most stuff was rationed simply because we did not have enough and the greed of the few could cause starvation for others.
      It was a time when we all hung together with rationing lasting until the early 50s. The war financially broke us with the principal cause being 1939 to 41 when all our purchases from the USA had to be paid for in gold in advance.
      Rationing lasted so long after the war as the principal grain and food supplier prioritised food supplies to Germany whilst we, France and other allied countries struggled to feed ourselves. The vast bulk of the American people have no idea of the privations suffered by the European allies and many even now think that the USA won the war single handed.

    2. Thank you for your comment. I do not feel that the USA won single handed. I have come to realize for quite some time, in war there are no winners. Only losers. It is a sad fact to read that the principal reason the rationing was so protracted was because of the demand of gold payment for goods by the USA. At the same time period, the average USA citizen was not allowed to own gold! I understand that after the war, and maybe because of it, that socialism was voted in. Most of my information is from WarTimeFarm (both the book and the series) and a book called Make Do and Mend, a compilation of government pamphlets used during WW2. I was aghast when I learned how very difficult life was in the UK during that time period. I do, however, feel "There by the Grace of God go I." You just never know.

      The Federal Reserve Act was established in Dec., 1913. Through stealth, we now have a central bank, a private bank with no accountability. From what I understand, the UK also has a central bank. With such harsh requirements for food I wonder if there is a connection. What about Canada? They sold grain to the UK before the war.

      Thank you again, for your comment.

  17. My family just moved from Philadelphia to the Amish country. I'm about to find out how difficult it is grow my own food.

  18. Wow. Very sobering.
    I truly thank God for my salvation and for the knowledge that He will take care of me in life and death.
    Also im grateful that my mother in law introduced our family to a plant based diet.
    My children are thriving and we are all super healthy. Belive me we get plenty of protein.
    After reading Patrice's adventures of raising cows and chickens I know I don't have what it takes to properly care for animals.
    Yes to shoes! I remember reading about a holocaust survivor telling of how her father forced her to put on her winter boots wgen she was pickedup as a teenager. While others who wore their summer sandals were breaking off their frost bitten toes, her feet were ok. I am always certain to have boots for my children in their next size up or even larger.

  19. Did you know that the small country of NZ has only 4.7 million people and yet has 1.2 million firearms in civilian hands ? and that you can have full auto guns such as M16 ( True ! ) and suppressors here are not only encouraged here but often are bought with a rifle ?

    The country is the size of England yet has a small population !, why am I telling you this ? well lots of people here are self sufficient ( not in the cities though ) many ,many people do canning, grow fruit tree's and really hate big brother poking their nose in, so prepping is incorporated in many people's country life style, my own attitude is one that I really do see myself as having temporary abode on this planet and my real home is in heaven with the Lord, I just have custodianship of perhaps some land while I am here and being a good husband/father/provider.

    I am a prepper because I see that is part of my legacy to those coming after me, doom and gloom ? sure there is, for thousands of years men and women have been eating , drinking and marrying and the cycle of life goes on, see, none of us know when a big life changing collapse will occur, I believe it will happen for two reasons, compound debt such as fiat money always ends badly, it is only a question of when, will it be in my lifetime ? or my childrens ?, I think my lifetime, we will all die, many sooner than later, so my mindest is to see that good rises from a collapse and give my knowledge, my morals, my values to pass down to others, so that when I go to my real home, my children's children will know me and that it a legacy worth passing on no matter how bad things get. Life is worth living, even when you are in a hospital bed. I have been there on a death bed, I still show younger people, bush tracking and living with nature skills.


  20. Many folks are self-sufficient but very few are survival-minded. If you doubt that, read 'A Failure of Civility' as fjord (1st comment) recommends. The distinction is made perfectly clear by page 10.
    Montana Guy

  21. All of the above is over the top -Pollyanna optimistic. NOTHING you can do will prepare you for TEOTWAWKI. You cannot read a book, or any number of books. OR stock pile enough Freeze dry and TP to "survive the collapse". The "prepper" fantasy world is one where they are the hero surviving in their own movie. The ugly truth is that NO ONE in our modern civilization is "ready" or can be MADE "ready" .In the first wave of "the great die off" EVERYONE over 60 will be dead in the first year. As will EVERYONE on life support meds.ALMOST EVERYONE under 10 and ANYONE stupid enough to "bug out" (the "bug outs" will be the "golden hoard" everyone is afraid of) WILL DIE. In the second wave you'll see the "stock pile" crowd starve as the food runs out and they turn on each other, but that will end quickly. The gardeners will live for a while, they may even prosper without government to steal from them, but unless they form villages for protection from marauders that won't last long ether. In truth without modern civilization ,medicine , a manufacturing , and distribution net, the 18th century is the most optimistic thing we can look for. If we get to "everyman for himself" then all bets are off and its back to the caves for everyone. We "Preppers" had better learn to play nice with each other , or learn to watch 90% of women die in childbirth 90% of children die before age 10, and the few that live spend their short violent lives fighting off the tribe from the next cave over who want them for supper.

  22. Unless a contagion is developed and purposely spread throughout populations, what you are suggesting is in error.

    Although those who absolutely need the medications will have problems, there are those who are on medications that are **not** beneficial to them or anyone else. During the Confederacy, there was a vast shortage of medications, including mercury. Not having mercury was a blessing.

    During the 1800's in Europe, five out of 1000 women died in home birth, but ten times more than that in hospitals. Bad Hygiene! was the cause.

    Even the polio epidemic in my childhood should be put into perspective. According to the Mayo clinic: "The poliovirus resides only in humans and enters the environment in the feces of someone who's infected. Poliovirus spreads primarily through the fecal-oral route, especially in areas where sanitation is inadequate." Hygiene issue again.

    I propose that proper hygiene practices should be at the top of all preparedness lists. We have gotten complacent over the past sixty plus years. This means without antibacterial anything. Learn to do it the old fashioned way. A back up plan is essential. At some point, the bleach and antibacterial products will be used up. They are carcinogenic and should be used with caution anyway.

    1. Chlorine is a naturally occuring element

  23. All of you think about guns, basic food, fortresses and such, but do you realize thats not even all? You can make a community, farm happily, abd the hordes will get you. Bug in they will get you. Ammo will be so rare you wont use it. Unless you can make new one. Cold weapons have limited range, plus there will be always someone with ammo and funcioning gun. There will be no doctors left in reach (probably) so even small injury ends up with you dead. Flu? Be in warm and trink something hot (no black or green tea, you'll be lucky to have some fruit tea). Maybe you will even survive. Pray for teotwawki situation would not happen. And be prepared that if it happens you will die in the furs half a year.

  24. The scenario that scares me the most is an EMP either as an attack or natural event. Of the two, I think I would prefer a natural event because it would affect more of the world and lesson my concerns about an invasion. If the EMP event is an attack, then America will have to deal with an almost 80% fatality rate from starvation and anarchy. If only 20% 0f the population survives, then countries llike China and Mexico can move large numbers of their populations into the unoccupied or scarcely occupied lands of America. So the follow-on events after an EMP will probably be anarchy and an invasion. With almost all electronics nonfunctional, the military will have limited control of communications. The survivors in the lands being occupied will have a whole new set of problems.