Sigh. It happened again. I ticked off a reader. The subject – you guessed it – is pressure canning vs. water-bath canning.
This is the comment, which came in on an older blog post about canning bacon bits. Someone had asked, "Can you do them in a water bath if you don't have a pressure canner?" I replied, "Absolutely NOT. Bacon (and all meat) is low acid, so it MUST be processed in a pressure canner. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. Boiling meats in a water-bath for ten hours cannot replace pressure. Do not risk botulism by processing meats or other low-acid foods in a water-bath. If you’re serious about preserving food, it’s worth investing in a pressure canner and learning its proper usage."
And that, I thought, was that ... until this morning, when a comment came in as follows: "Yes don’t let anyone tell you NO! This is how it’s been done before pressure canners were invented, meats are 3 hrs boiling with water 2” over jars. Theirs [sic] many groups on FB [Facebook] that will teach you how.. Blessings."
And, once again, I lost it – and no doubt ticked off the reader as a result. Here's what I replied:
"WRONG. Why do you think pressure canners were invented in the first place? It was because scientists learned boiling water doesn't kill botulism spores. Three hours – ten hours – a hundred hours in a water bath will NOT render low-acid foods safe. WHY CAN'T PEOPLE GRASP THIS CONCEPT???!!! Do you refuse to wear a seat belt while driving as well because cars were invented before seat belts?"
Arrgghh. It is SUCH a simple concept, time-tested and scientifically proven, and yet people will blithely continue to endanger their families by water-bathing low-acid foods.
Don urges me not to spike my blood pressure and just let such comments go. But I can't. I just can't let someone come onto this blog and spread the notion that unsafe canning practices are fine.
Completely agree with you. Why on earth would anyone take the risk when pressure canners are not expensive even when new? Do they eat willow bark for a headache?
ReplyDeleteActually white willow bark tincture for a headache is better than aspirin since God created the willow bark and man took the active ingredient out of it to make ASA. Unfortunately for man he missed the other ingredients that prevent the side effects that aspirin has. Herbalism/Aromotherapy is a good thing, please do not discourage others from learning something that will help when the SHTF. No more Big Pharma is a good thing, getting off prescription drugs is also a good thing. Using the plants that God gave us for health and food is also a good thing. Sorry for my rant but herbs are a part of my life and seem to work better for me than prescription drugs and OTC drugs. Part of self sufficiency is also knowing how to care for yourself medically. I may be in my 60s but I have always loved herbs and now am learning so much more about how they help. Nettle leaf is helping me in my Adrenal overload, so yeah, I am a tad partial to herbs, plus they tastes pretty good too.
DeleteIf you didn't respond to these ill-informed comments, some readers might assume your silence may mean tacit agreement.
ReplyDeleteAnd old beans that you cannot cook properly are excellent run through a pressure cooker :-)
ReplyDeleteI hate throwing away food. I also hate killing my family with old school (They Always did it that way, folks).
It *is* possible to kill Clostridium botulinum by boiling. It's just so hard and variable that you are guaranteed to make a mistake. Spoilage rates using boiling are in the 20-70% range for low-acid foods done this way. So, yeah, you do kill the bugs -- about 50% of the time.
ReplyDeleteThis is because the rate of decline in botulism is a function of the distribution of heat in the food (the center of a pot often has a different temp than the edge or bottom), and importantly, the number of spores that were there to start with. In one study, at 10 lbs pressure and 240 deg F, botulism organisms were destroyed in 4 minutes, while at boiling it took 313 minutes. Another review noted:
The success of any method of processing canned foods is determined largely by the rapidity of heat penetration into the container and the thermal
destruction time of spoilage microorganisms at the pressure and temperature. This is easily understood when thermal resistance of Cl. botulinum at 212° and 240° F. is compared. The resistance of this organism at 212 [deg] F. is 360 minutes while at 240 degrees] it is only 10 minutes in neutral phosphate solution.
See: https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/pdf/10.2105/AJPH.25.3.301
Note that with higher inoculums, uneven or inconstant heat, or other variations, even 360 minutes will not be enough.
Virtually all outbreaks of home-canned botulism poisoning in the US in recent years have involved failure to use pressure canners. For one review see:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0362028X22129510#bb0150
There are formulas to show the decline in botulism at temps between 212 F and 240 F. There's also Odlaug TE, Pflug IJ Applied Env Microbiol 34(1):23-29. One thing that can trip people up is that the safety threshold is a 12-log reduction, so the processing times become unreasonable, and even then there are unknowable variables that would make it a crapshoot (Odlaug used liquids for testing purposes, which are obviously easier to be consistent with than chunky foods with varying densities). Beyond that, however, BWB canning low-acid foods is brain-dead because of the inefficiency if nothing else. Who would choose to boil something for half a day in the hope of not killing anyone who ate it when it could be safely processed in no more than 90 minutes in a pressure canner?
DeleteScientific fact - water boils at 212 degrees and does not go any higher no matter how long you boil the water. Scientific fact - botulism spores are killed at 250 degrees which can only be reached with a pressure canner. I too get tired of people who want to argue the safety of water bath canning low-acid foods. They’re playing Russian roulette with their family’s safety. End of discussion.
ReplyDeleteI just had this conversation today in regards to oven canning. She said she had looked into it, and there was a bunch of people saying it was safe. I finally said "why would you take a chance with your families health when there are so many SAFE ways to preserve foods?" I can't even.
ReplyDeleteOn the one hand I am delighted that there seems to be a resurgence of interest in preserving your own food. On the other hand I am dismayed that there are so many that would rather chance the "easy" way of doing it instead of the scientifically proven safe way of doing it. It all gets easier the more you do it. Just hang in there and keep doing it - the right, safe way - and soon it will all be second nature to you.
ReplyDeleteStay on that soap box, Patrice!
Some people don't want to be confused by facts when they already know the answer.
ReplyDeletePatrice, sadly some people are going to learn this lesson the hard way.
ReplyDeleteI may not water or pressure can any foods YET, but I do KNOW that low acid foods MUST be pressure canned. That is why pressure canners came about, because of too many deaths and hospitalizations from water bathing everything. I am a 71 yo woman who will eat what others can up, that is those I trust.
ReplyDeleteLRAUDE
Patrice, we can only ultimately point to the data and present it. You have spoken on the matter repeatedly here over the years; there should be no-one that has any misunderstanding on what you believe (if that was a concern).
ReplyDeleteFor all of my general dislike of many parts of the industrial age, one thing it has often given us is repeatable processes that are safe and effective. Older process may work, but they can lack that same level of safety and effectivity. To the point of others above, why take the risk?
I totally agree with you, as a nurse I have cared for patients with botulism....scary illness, and usually fatal without excellent medical care, ie. ICU. I too don't understand this belief and taking a chance with your families health. Just not worth it, why would you risk you and your families lives???
ReplyDeleteMaybe telling others what it actually is and how it can affect someone instead of just saying it is dangerous might help? PJ
ReplyDeleteBotulism: a paralyzing nerve toxin, considered to be one of the most potent and lethal substances in the world. It’s produced by the bacterium Clostridium botulinum and sometimes by strains of Clostridium butyricum and Clostridium baratii. The rod-shaped bacteria are commonly found in soil and sediments from lakes, rivers and oceans. The bacteria thrive in low-oxygen conditions, such as canned foods, deep wounds & the intestinal tract, but when threatened form protective spores with a hard coating that allows the bacteria to survive for years.
The danger is not from the spores themselves but what they produce while germinating. As the C. botulinum bacteria grow, they create eight types of neurotoxins that are so deadly, even microscopic amounts can kill.
Because botulism toxin paralyzes muscles, early and classic signs of the illness are drooping eyelids and blurred or double vision, dry mouth, slurred speech and difficulty swallowing. If left untreated, greater paralysis of muscles of the arms, legs and trunk of the body will occur, affecting the ability to breathe.
Babies infected w/botulism will be poor feeders & seem lethargic, w/weak cry & poor muscle tone, can also be constipated.
Botulism does not cause fever; those affected are usually alert and aware of their surroundings. Once botulism is confirmed, it can be treated with an antitoxin and, in some cases, antibiotics. If the antitoxin is given before paralysis is complete, helps shorten recovery, which requires regrowth of motor nerve endings. Patient can be hospitalized for supportive treatment/ventilator, for weeks or months until paralysis improves.
In some cases, muscle weakness & shortness of breath can last years.
That's a good idea.
DeleteIt really makes the point that it's life threatening.
I'm in Australia and rely upon the US canning guidelines to keep us safe. I'd seen my mother-in-law bottle peaches and apricots decades ago but upon discovering your blog, I was inspired to do more eg. vegies and other low acid foods. I'm so glad that you have championed the "safety" pathway. So many canning comments on various groups make me cringe. I'm tired of hearing the "my mother and grandmother have done this for decades and we're all still alive to tell the story" excuse. What concerns me the most is that those keen to learn may listen to and be persuaded to believe that these unsafe practices are fine. I've noted angry responses to those who try to suggest there are safer methods to use. Jenny
ReplyDeleteI've been frustrated trying to share the need pressure can low acid foods before also. I informed twice and gave up -- they didn't want to hear it.
ReplyDeleteI think it is because pressure cookers are widely perceived as 'scary'. I thought that the widespread use of Instant Pots would have lessened that fear.
ReplyDelete